Creativity and Allah - Somebody Barstool this

[LHX]

cross-posted

http://www.wutang-corp.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34638

i started this thread at Wu-Corp as a response to a thread where i got into a heated discussion about the Qur'an and man's inability to 'meet' any of the 'divine' challenges set forth in the Qur'an


this is the main body of that thread - please to be applying the barstool treatment if applicable

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the idea of 'creating things' came up in that thread


in a mythological concept, we are presented with the idea of live beings raised from dirt - 'created'


but what is creativity really?


what does it mean to create something?

if you write a fictional story in which you 'create' characters and 'create' a universe - how does that differ from what we are currently experiencing?


from a objective perspective, it is not impossible to fathom a narrator in your head, and a story in which you are the main character: "and this is the part of the story when you read that post by LHX"



it is beyond the realm of provability, but it is also beyond the realm of disprovability?





if you create a 'fictional' character, what is his relationship to you?

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the rest of the thread has some interesting posts

[Triple Zero]

an awesome webcomic exploring this idea:
http://oneoverzero.comicgenesis.com/d/20000827.html
it's exactly 1000 strips long, if you have time i can recommend anybody to read it.

the author is christian btw, but a smart one (except that he's christian)

[LHX]

nice

i just read the first few and i see where it might be going



page loads slow tho

[Triple Zero]

maybe this mirror is faster?
http://www.undefined.net/1/0/

[LMNO]

but what is creativity really?

This question is pretty vague, but to me, creativity sometimes is the combination of two previously uncombined ideas.

what does it mean to create something?

This question is borderline meaningless.  It means whatever the creator thinks it means.

if you write a fictional story in which you 'create' characters and 'create' a universe - how does that differ from what we are currently experiencing?

The created characters are not directly influenced by the non-created universe; the creator's mind acts as a mediator.

from a objective perspective, it is not impossible to fathom a narrator in your head, and a story in which you are the main character: "and this is the part of the story when you read that post by LHX"

The narrator you speak of is a reactionary one.  In a created story, the narrator, in what ever voice is expressed, is omnicient.

[Triple Zero]

does simply writing down Z^2 + C generate the entire Mandelbrot or Julia fractal?

Gaston Julia investigated the properties of these fractals long before the computing power existed to actually plot them.

i've seen physics students walk around with T-shirts ".. and God said <complicated formula for photons or something>, and there was light"

i also think there is not as much of a link between what is generally understood as "creativity" and "the act of creating something", or at least the poster seems to be reading (imho) too much in the similarity between two words.

[LMNO]

I might have just stepped in a puddle of stupid, but I don't see how your first three paragraphs relates to the OP.

[Triple Zero]

ok maybe i was taken too much steps in my mind

the example i gave was a part of a discussion i had with another friend, a long time ago (i may invite him over here as well, once he gets back from Peru the bastard)

it relates because the OP was (partly) about whether by telling a story you create an alternative universe or not.
which is similar to asking whether writing down a mathematical formula implies the graph of it, or the sort of natural phenomenon it describes.

the answer is most probably "no", btw.

in the 1/0 cartoon this issue is addressed when the narrator was accused of being cruel because the characters were suffering (or dying or something), and then the narrator, felt, that, if this was indeed the case he should make up for his sin so he told a story about "the perfect universe in which every living being led perfectly happy fulfilling lives ever after"

on the other hand i might have stepped into that puddle and this was entirely not what the OP was about.

also i understand i'm not particularly helping in applying the barstool, just giving my thoughts

[LHX]

The narrator you speak of is a reactionary one.  In a created story, the narrator, in what ever voice is expressed, is omnicient.

but it is not beyond imagining a omniscient narrator's voice

(what was that will ferrell movie?)


creation is the act of combining 2 previously uncombined ideas?


but it is not actually the combining that is creativity right? - it is the subsequent 'thing' which emerges that is the creation yes?

[Cramulus]

From wikipedia:

Creativity (or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new ideas or concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts. From a scientific point of view, the products of creative thought (sometimes referred to as divergent thought) are usually considered to have both originality and appropriateness. An alternative, more everyday conception of creativity is that it is simply the act of making something new.

[Bo]

but what is creativity really?

This question is pretty vague, but to me, creativity sometimes is the combination of two previously uncombined ideas.

Is creativity the ability to combine? It seems that the result is important, so creativity is the ability to create? but then: is getting a child creative? Is creating a hole in the ground, when you fall out of a tree creative?

[AFK]

So I should stop referring to the bathroom as the Cradle of Creativity?

[AFK]

but what is creativity really?

This question is pretty vague, but to me, creativity sometimes is the combination of two previously uncombined ideas.

Is creativity the ability to combine? It seems that the result is important, so creativity is the ability to create? but then: is getting a child creative? Is creating a hole in the ground, when you fall out of a tree creative?

what do you mean by "getting" a child? 

[tyrannosaurus vex]

you know, when the Stork comes and drops a bundle of joy down the chimney, complete with Owner's Manual and a lifetime supply of disposable diapers.

[Jenne]