Open Bar: Funnier Than White People Practicing Voodoo

[Nephew Twiddleton]

Today I found out that Marion Zimmer Bradley was a child molester/rapist and that she and her husband got their rocks off by diddling kids when they weren't writing books or founding the SCA or starting covens or whatever.

I never got into her work much, but she was a big influence on a lot of my pagan friends and she was the mentor to some authors I really enjoy. So. Kinda vomiting in my mouth, here. I lack the ability to separate art from artist in the case of child abuse.

I thought about making a separate post about this since it's sort of messing with my head and there's all sorts of wonderful discussions to be had about this shitstorm. But I kinda wanna curl up in my closet and not come out, instead.

Not entirely sure why, except that it's Summer.

What

[Nephew Twiddleton]

Today I found out that Marion Zimmer Bradley was a child molester/rapist and that she and her husband got their rocks off by diddling kids when they weren't writing books or founding the SCA or starting covens or whatever.

I never got into her work much, but she was a big influence on a lot of my pagan friends and she was the mentor to some authors I really enjoy. So. Kinda vomiting in my mouth, here. I lack the ability to separate art from artist in the case of child abuse.

I thought about making a separate post about this since it's sort of messing with my head and there's all sorts of wonderful discussions to be had about this shitstorm. But I kinda wanna curl up in my closet and not come out, instead.

Not entirely sure why, except that it's Summer.

Start the thread.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

Bradley and Breen separated in 1979 but remained married, and continued a business relationship and lived on the same street for over a decade. They officially divorced on May 9, 1990, the year Breen was arrested on child molestation charges of a 12 year old boy.[2] She had edited Breen's book Greek Love, which was dedicated to her, and in 1965 had contributed an article, "Feminine Equivalents of Greek Love in Modern Literature", to Breen's journal The International Journal of Greek Love.[3][4] She had known about Breen's sexual interests and previously accepted his sexual abuse of a 14 year old boy.

WHAT.

[Cardinal Pizza Deliverance.]

Bradley and Breen separated in 1979 but remained married, and continued a business relationship and lived on the same street for over a decade. They officially divorced on May 9, 1990, the year Breen was arrested on child molestation charges of a 12 year old boy.[2] She had edited Breen's book Greek Love, which was dedicated to her, and in 1965 had contributed an article, "Feminine Equivalents of Greek Love in Modern Literature", to Breen's journal The International Journal of Greek Love.[3][4] She had known about Breen's sexual interests and previously accepted his sexual abuse of a 14 year old boy.

WHAT.

Yeah. I read a deposition she gave and the attorney asks her about five or six other kids and why she never reported it to the police or believed her daughter when the girl told MZB that Breen was doing all this shit. And that doesn't even cover what MZB did, herself.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

Bradley and Breen separated in 1979 but remained married, and continued a business relationship and lived on the same street for over a decade. They officially divorced on May 9, 1990, the year Breen was arrested on child molestation charges of a 12 year old boy.[2] She had edited Breen's book Greek Love, which was dedicated to her, and in 1965 had contributed an article, "Feminine Equivalents of Greek Love in Modern Literature", to Breen's journal The International Journal of Greek Love.[3][4] She had known about Breen's sexual interests and previously accepted his sexual abuse of a 14 year old boy.

WHAT.

Yeah. I read a deposition she gave and the attorney asks her about five or six other kids and why she never reported it to the police or believed her daughter when the girl told MZB that Breen was doing all this shit. And that doesn't even cover what MZB did, herself.

I see.

I really have nothing else to say until more comes out.

I also hate shit like this, because my immediate reaction is to reject all art from artist. Which is wrong. The art stands on its own propriety.

I do recall, however, the rampant accounts of sexual abuse, ranging from rape to religiously sanctioned incest (which was also woman priestess raping her brother under false pretext), in Mists of Avalon.

Actually the more I think about the story, the less I am surprised....

[Cardinal Pizza Deliverance.]

Bradley and Breen separated in 1979 but remained married, and continued a business relationship and lived on the same street for over a decade. They officially divorced on May 9, 1990, the year Breen was arrested on child molestation charges of a 12 year old boy.[2] She had edited Breen's book Greek Love, which was dedicated to her, and in 1965 had contributed an article, "Feminine Equivalents of Greek Love in Modern Literature", to Breen's journal The International Journal of Greek Love.[3][4] She had known about Breen's sexual interests and previously accepted his sexual abuse of a 14 year old boy.

WHAT.

Yeah. I read a deposition she gave and the attorney asks her about five or six other kids and why she never reported it to the police or believed her daughter when the girl told MZB that Breen was doing all this shit. And that doesn't even cover what MZB did, herself.

I see.

I really have nothing else to say until more comes out.

I also hate shit like this, because my immediate reaction is to reject all art from artist. Which is wrong. The art stands on its own propriety.

I do recall, however, the rampant accounts of sexual abuse, ranging from rape to religiously sanctioned incest (which was also woman priestess raping her brother under false pretext), in Mists of Avalon.

Actually the more I think about the story, the less I am surprised....

I don't think art stands on its own in child abuse cases. That can make me a horrible person, I don't care.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

Bradley and Breen separated in 1979 but remained married, and continued a business relationship and lived on the same street for over a decade. They officially divorced on May 9, 1990, the year Breen was arrested on child molestation charges of a 12 year old boy.[2] She had edited Breen's book Greek Love, which was dedicated to her, and in 1965 had contributed an article, "Feminine Equivalents of Greek Love in Modern Literature", to Breen's journal The International Journal of Greek Love.[3][4] She had known about Breen's sexual interests and previously accepted his sexual abuse of a 14 year old boy.

WHAT.

Yeah. I read a deposition she gave and the attorney asks her about five or six other kids and why she never reported it to the police or believed her daughter when the girl told MZB that Breen was doing all this shit. And that doesn't even cover what MZB did, herself.

I see.

I really have nothing else to say until more comes out.

I also hate shit like this, because my immediate reaction is to reject all art from artist. Which is wrong. The art stands on its own propriety.

I do recall, however, the rampant accounts of sexual abuse, ranging from rape to religiously sanctioned incest (which was also woman priestess raping her brother under false pretext), in Mists of Avalon.

Actually the more I think about the story, the less I am surprised....

I don't think art stands on its own in child abuse cases. That can make me a horrible person, I don't care.

The more I'm recalling Mists of Avalon, the more I'm thinking it's an academic point.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

That's pretty fucking creepy. As I mentioned earlier in this thread, for myself personally I have a hard time enjoying art when it is associated with really awful things (Woody Allen movies come to mind).

[Cainad (dec.)]

I finally figured out the Ignore function and by god it is rad.

[Junkenstein]

I'm refusing to use it out of a misguided display of empathy with the mods. I can confirm that you are missing nothing of value. 

[Reginald Ret]

Bradley and Breen separated in 1979 but remained married, and continued a business relationship and lived on the same street for over a decade. They officially divorced on May 9, 1990, the year Breen was arrested on child molestation charges of a 12 year old boy.[2] She had edited Breen's book Greek Love, which was dedicated to her, and in 1965 had contributed an article, "Feminine Equivalents of Greek Love in Modern Literature", to Breen's journal The International Journal of Greek Love.[3][4] She had known about Breen's sexual interests and previously accepted his sexual abuse of a 14 year old boy.

WHAT.

Yeah. I read a deposition she gave and the attorney asks her about five or six other kids and why she never reported it to the police or believed her daughter when the girl told MZB that Breen was doing all this shit. And that doesn't even cover what MZB did, herself.

I see.

I really have nothing else to say until more comes out.

I also hate shit like this, because my immediate reaction is to reject all art from artist. Which is wrong. The art stands on its own propriety.

I do recall, however, the rampant accounts of sexual abuse, ranging from rape to religiously sanctioned incest (which was also woman priestess raping her brother under false pretext), in Mists of Avalon.

Actually the more I think about the story, the less I am surprised....

I don't think art stands on its own in child abuse cases. That can make me a horrible person, I don't care.

Agreed, beyond a certain point hurting the bad person is a sufficient goal for many acts, including hating their art. Not very effective, but that is beside the point.

I finally figured out the Ignore function and by god it is rad.

It is, isn't it!

[Suu]

Today I found out that Marion Zimmer Bradley was a child molester/rapist and that she and her husband got their rocks off by diddling kids when they weren't writing books or founding the SCA or starting covens or whatever.

I never got into her work much, but she was a big influence on a lot of my pagan friends and she was the mentor to some authors I really enjoy. So. Kinda vomiting in my mouth, here. I lack the ability to separate art from artist in the case of child abuse.

I thought about making a separate post about this since it's sort of messing with my head and there's all sorts of wonderful discussions to be had about this shitstorm. But I kinda wanna curl up in my closet and not come out, instead.

Not entirely sure why, except that it's Summer.

The only thing MZB did for the SCA was give it their name when she called to book space in a public park for an event. They didn't have a name for their group, and she came up with it off the cuff. That's her claim to fame. The group itself was founded in Diana Listmaker's backyard in Berkeley. They were essentially a bunch of hippie college students who were obsessed with Tolkien.

MZB was aware of Walter Breen's behavior, but I don't believe anything was ever found that stated she actually engaged in it with him, but she did always seem to support him for some reason. The situation is very bizarre. I've never actually gotten into her writing, kinda glad I didn't now.

[Suu]

Also, I seemed to have pulled my left groin muscle during my workouts last week. If you ever wanted to simultaneously ruin your athletic progress and sex life at the same time, have I got an injury for you!

[The Good Reverend Roger]

I finally figured out the Ignore function and by god it is rad.

I'm refusing to use it out of a misguided display of empathy with the mods. I can confirm that you are missing nothing of value.

Might not be too much a problem.  Inge/UB seems to be having a moment, today (or, rather, yesterday).  As such, I am merely venting all of her posts into her unlimited thread.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

There's a word for what We're do.

We call it CYBORG PRIDE.