The Atlas Shrugged Themepark?

[Doktor Howl]

I think i'm missing something.
everyone is gleefully thinking about how Mr. Thiel's Island is going to burn to the seafloor in a spectacular failure of radical libertarian foolishness....
but.
all i've seen is that he's donated 1.25M to the seasteading institue, which specifically says on their website that they aren't going to be building any islands themselves.  they just do studies, etc.
so...
who's making an island here?

Come on Ippy, you've been here longer than I and you know that when ANY libertarian idea is discussed, no matter WHAT, it's met with :lulzlibertardians: are teh lail.

Concrete concepts are not necessary if the get in the way of teh lulz

That's an unfair generalization.  I personally don't rip on libertarians at every opportunity.

Because it's sort've like laughing at the retarded kid who can't operate the swing set.

Certainly is a lot of generalizing going on ITT, that's for damn sure.

Pots, Kettles, Ravens and Crows.

Difference is, I'm right.

[Scribbly]

The people I work with think this is the best thing ever. 

I have been given the task of convincing these people to advertise on our site. I can't wait to see how this goes.

[Disco Pickle]

Difference is, I'm right.

and you always are.

[Doktor Howl]

Difference is, I'm right.

and you always are.

Nope.  That's Nigel's job.

I'm just right at the moment.

[Nephew Twiddleton]

I wouldnt say your ideology is wrong pickle. Its just that libertarians are overlooking the same thing communists do- the fact that humans will screw it up.

[Cain]

I wouldnt say your ideology is wrong pickle. Its just that libertarians are overlooking the same thing everyone else is - that they're all wrong.

More accurate, I would say.

Especially since liberals and conservatives (and social democrats and fascists and anarchists and theocrats and monarchists and autocrats and consociationalists and futarchists and imperalists and aristocrats and and Noocrats and stratocrats and technocrats and timocrats and tribes) do not exactly have stellar records in this area, either.

Synarchism may work, but no-one can actually ever find out, by definition.

[Elder Iptuous]

it seems to me that all political ideologies, when taken to the wall, will end in disaster.  this is for precisely the reason that you say Twid.  we'll screw it up.
so we are destined to muck around in a more flexible, but not completely satisfying middle ground.
of course there's lots of room for difference in the middle ground and people want to move our current system in any one of various directions.
So there are those that advocate moving in one direction or another that proclaim we should take our system all the way, and they look like fools.  Unfortunately, anyone that believes we should move in that direction to a limited extent can be lumped in with them, and this seems to be significant in the case of the 'libertarian' minded folk.
It has been my experience that when i advocate moving in a libertarian direction on a given subject, the response is often either someone saying, 'Yes! and we should also have private firefighting!', or another saying, 'You're a retard. i bet you also want private firefighting, and hate smudgy people, and live in your mother's basement!'
That seems a shame to me...

I am however, not riding that bandwagon like i used to.  I'm thinking maybe ECH has the right idea, personally.

[P3nT4gR4m]

It's a perfectly workable idea if it weren't for the fact that it's human beings trying to implement it. Species is not capable of the level of cooperation required.

Of course this is true of non-libertarian utopian floating commune - type setups, like capitalism or democracy or theocracy and any other system you care to mention but these have a bit more breathing space on account of they're intrinsically stagnant, huge and tend to rot slowly from the top down. Floaty utopias have much more potential to splodey really quickly.

[Disco Pickle]

I wouldnt say your ideology is wrong pickle. Its just that libertarians are overlooking the same thing communists do- the fact that humans will screw it up.

I don't know that the ideology as a whole completely ignores that.  In some ways it even provides a framework in which to prepare for when you DO eventually screw up so that it's not completely catastrophic to yourself or your family.  

Like any other body of ideas you have strict adherents to certain things, loosely followed tenants by others, and lots of people just picking and choosing which parts they like but not bothering to rename it because the name is still the closest fit to anything else largely recognizable.

Broad stroking libertarians as "trust fund babies living in starbucks and don't like brown skinned people" is just like saying "All conservative republicans are rich and hate the poor and want biblical law in the US" or "all liberal democrats want to destroy or nationalize all corporations, are godless heathens and dream of a communist revolution in the USA"

Used for comedy, it's great stuff.  

I have no complaints about what I've learned and I've met some really driven, intelligent, and well read people over the years who claim to be libertarian.  Many more than I've ever met who claimed to be liberal or conservative.  I do try and stay away from the ends of the political bell curve both in associations and personal thoughts.

To each their own.

[Scribbly]

It is probably worth reiterating that the group - although founded by a libertarian - does not want to just make libertarian islands.

What they actually want to do is develop the technology to the point where it is economically feasible to create floating, self-sufficient settlements. Then see what forms of governance work in those settlements.

I agree that 'the type that is shot by pirates and/or dies from horrific disasters' seems the most likely, but.

[Disco Pickle]

It's a perfectly workable idea if it weren't for the fact that it's human beings trying to implement it. Species is not capable of the level of cooperation required.

Of course this is true of non-libertarian utopian floating commune - type setups, like capitalism or democracy or theocracy and any other system you care to mention but these have a bit more breathing space on account of they're intrinsically stagnant, huge and tend to rot slowly from the top down. Floaty utopias have much more potential to splodey really quickly.

It could be the first time a video game has predicted the future.

Every time I think of them I still think of Bioshock and Rapture.

[P3nT4gR4m]

It is probably worth reiterating that the group - although founded by a libertarian - does not want to just make libertarian islands.

What they actually want to do is develop the technology to the point where it is economically feasible to create floating, self-sufficient settlements. Then see what forms of governance work in those settlements.

I agree that 'the type that is shot by pirates and/or dies from horrific disasters' seems the most likely, but.

That I can get behind - the concept of building settlements out at sea but they'd be governed by existing governments. I don't mean - it'd be better if they were - I mean they will. As soon as they become economically viable they'll lose independence. Of course if they don't become economically viable - that's where the lulz is 

[Doktor Howl]

Broad stroking libertarians as "trust fund babies living in starbucks and don't like brown skinned people" is just like saying "All conservative republicans are rich and hate the poor and want biblical law in the US" or "all liberal democrats want to destroy or nationalize all corporations, are godless heathens and dream of a communist revolution in the USA"

In all the above cases, you are judged by the company you keep.

This is why the only acceptable political position is "asshat".  Fact is, politics are the stupidest thing people ever invented.  And libertarianism and its retarded cousin communism are the second stupidest form of politics, right after anarchism...And no anarchist will ever have my respect for their political views until they make me their king.

[Doktor Howl]

It's a perfectly workable idea if it weren't for the fact that it's human beings trying to implement it. Species is not capable of the level of cooperation required.

Of course this is true of non-libertarian utopian floating commune - type setups, like capitalism or democracy or theocracy and any other system you care to mention but these have a bit more breathing space on account of they're intrinsically stagnant, huge and tend to rot slowly from the top down. Floaty utopias have much more potential to splodey really quickly.

It could be the first time a video game has predicted the future.

Every time I think of them I still think of Bioshock and Rapture.

Bullshit.  Zaxxon predicted reality way back in the 80s.

[Disco Pickle]

It's a perfectly workable idea if it weren't for the fact that it's human beings trying to implement it. Species is not capable of the level of cooperation required.

Of course this is true of non-libertarian utopian floating commune - type setups, like capitalism or democracy or theocracy and any other system you care to mention but these have a bit more breathing space on account of they're intrinsically stagnant, huge and tend to rot slowly from the top down. Floaty utopias have much more potential to splodey really quickly.

It could be the first time a video game has predicted the future.

Every time I think of them I still think of Bioshock and Rapture.

Bullshit.  Zaxxon predicted reality way back in the 80s.

Man, I had completely forgotten about that game.  Now I'm going to have to go dig out my emulator from whatever dusty folder it's in on my home computer and find the ROM for it.