Increasing rates of autism in the US?

[Doktor Howl]

What problems is she experiencing, specifically?

Extreme weirdness.

Hard to explain. You'd have to meet her. Nobody can figure out exactly what's "wrong" with her, only that she's definitely different from other children.

My son was like that, from ages 3-11.  Occasionally did inappropriate things (getting down on hands and knees to study a bug in a store, etc), responded to us, but when left alone was in his own world (which apparently involved John phillips Sousa-esque marching bands), etc.

Due to two of my cousins having autism, The Terrible Old Man suggested that might be the case.  It's the only time I ever lost my temper with the old Hessian.

He responded to us and others.  He wasn't autistic.  He just had more curiousity and imagination than social graces. 

Don't let the bastards label LO.  Just my advice.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

A close friend of mine has an autistic son, and has dealt with people, including teachers, treating him in ways that are outright cruel because they were convinced that he was just spoiled or stubborn, and that they could train it out of him. She's dealt with people judging her mothering, assuming that he's the way he is because she lets him get away with it.

I think I observed this sort of thing on the MAX today.

A woman and a teenage boy sat down across the aisle from me. I couldn't help but notice that the kid was not normal and got the vibe that he had autism. I've been around autistic people a number of times, but I also have always felt an odd connection to them—as though I have some intuitive understanding of their weirdness. Anyway, I formed this impression of the boy and the woman and carried on looking out the window nearby them looking for good surfaces for posters and graphics. Not far before I'm about to get off the train the boy abruptly leans over so he can see me, looks directly into my eyes and does a funny wave. So I smile and do a similar wave back. A moment later he does the same thing, smiling this time. The woman looks embarrassed and gently grabs his hand pushes it down onto his lap. She didn't even glance over to see who he was waving at. But the kid seems to have taken a liking to me and keeps leaning forward with a grin on his face, looking at me right in the eye and waving—and the woman keeps softly grabbing his hand and forcing it down. I wave back each time. Not once does the woman even look to see who he's waving at and seems to be getting more and more embarrassed as this little dynamic continues.

I tried to give her the benefit of the doubt, but I can't imagine what would justify her behavior. Even if the kid was previously being a complete shit, why would a caretaker, relative, or mother do that? WTF? I couldn't come up with any reasoning that made sense. Maybe it's my brain trying to make a bad "train" pun, but the idea that she was training autism out of him really seems to fit. It has the tinny ring of truth.

The thing is, you don't know. You just don't. It's natural to try to make sense of it and to come up with explanations that fit with your observations, but with such a brief period of observation you really have no idea what you were seeing, and less idea why she was reacting that way.

[Doktor Howl]

A close friend of mine has an autistic son, and has dealt with people, including teachers, treating him in ways that are outright cruel because they were convinced that he was just spoiled or stubborn, and that they could train it out of him. She's dealt with people judging her mothering, assuming that he's the way he is because she lets him get away with it.

I think I observed this sort of thing on the MAX today.

A woman and a teenage boy sat down across the aisle from me. I couldn't help but notice that the kid was not normal and got the vibe that he had autism. I've been around autistic people a number of times, but I also have always felt an odd connection to them—as though I have some intuitive understanding of their weirdness. Anyway, I formed this impression of the boy and the woman and carried on looking out the window nearby them looking for good surfaces for posters and graphics. Not far before I'm about to get off the train the boy abruptly leans over so he can see me, looks directly into my eyes and does a funny wave. So I smile and do a similar wave back. A moment later he does the same thing, smiling this time. The woman looks embarrassed and gently grabs his hand pushes it down onto his lap. She didn't even glance over to see who he was waving at. But the kid seems to have taken a liking to me and keeps leaning forward with a grin on his face, looking at me right in the eye and waving—and the woman keeps softly grabbing his hand and forcing it down. I wave back each time. Not once does the woman even look to see who he's waving at and seems to be getting more and more embarrassed as this little dynamic continues.

I tried to give her the benefit of the doubt, but I can't imagine what would justify her behavior. Even if the kid was previously being a complete shit, why would a caretaker, relative, or mother do that? WTF? I couldn't come up with any reasoning that made sense. Maybe it's my brain trying to make a bad "train" pun, but the idea that she was training autism out of him really seems to fit. It has the tinny ring of truth.

The thing is, you don't know. You just don't. It's natural to try to make sense of it and to come up with explanations that fit with your observations, but with such a brief period of observation you really have no idea what you were seeing, and less idea why she was reacting that way.

Grief, maybe.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

As far as labeling goes, I have issues with things like tracking in schools and know that schools are problematic. However, on the flip side, sometimes that diagnostic label is the only thing that forces resistant teachers to make individual allowances... which they should be making for every child, but unfortunately many teachers are more interested in consistency and authority than in individuality. "Autism" may be the label that prevents the "bad kid" label from getting slapped on that kid's file.

I tend to think that the resistance to labeling is more about the parents' egos than the children's well-being, anyway. My brother was diagnosed with high-functioning autism as an adult, and he felt so relieved... he didn't feel like he had a label, he felt like he had an explanation, and a source of information that he and his wife could refer to. An autistic adult friend here in Portland also has no issues with that "label". Why should they? Any more than I have issues with being labeled "epileptic"?

Autistic children have so much going on already. They know they're different, and may or may not care. My suspicion is that that worry about "labeling" them has everything to do with parents' aversion to their child being considered "defective" and next to nothing to do with the child having issues with the label. After all, take these same parents and I've never seen a single one of them object to their child being labeled "gifted".

I am far more concerned with making sure my child has appropriate medical or neurological assessment than in avoiding the stigma of a label, especially one that is protected by HIPAA. She may be brilliant. She may be retarded. I don't care, I just want her to grow up happy and with appropriate support.

[Doktor Howl]

As far as labeling goes, I have issues with things like tracking in schools and know that schools are problematic. However, on the flip side, sometimes that diagnostic label is the only thing that forces resistant teachers to make individual allowances... which they should be making for every child, but unfortunately many teachers are more interested in consistency and authority than in individuality. "Autism" may be the label that prevents the "bad kid" label from getting slapped on that kid's file.

Well, in my case - it may be very different for you and your family - I am damn glad I didn't allow the label, as my son turned out fine, and decided to join the Marines.  If he had the autism thing in his records, that job - and many others - would be closed to him forever.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

As far as labeling goes, I have issues with things like tracking in schools and know that schools are problematic. However, on the flip side, sometimes that diagnostic label is the only thing that forces resistant teachers to make individual allowances... which they should be making for every child, but unfortunately many teachers are more interested in consistency and authority than in individuality. "Autism" may be the label that prevents the "bad kid" label from getting slapped on that kid's file.

Well, in my case - it may be very different for you and your family - I am damn glad I didn't allow the label, as my son turned out fine, and decided to join the Marines.  If he had the autism thing in his records, that job - and many others - would be closed to him forever.

Yes, but he's not autistic. He wouldn't have "the autism thing" in his records without being diagnosed with autism, and a diagnosis of autism takes pretty intensive screening by one or more neurologists. You don't end up with autism in your medical record just for being screened for it, any more than you end up with diabetes in your medical records just because you had a glucose test.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

You keep saying "allow the label" like it's some sort of arbitrary sticky-tag some random entity wants to stick on kids. It's a neurological diagnosis. You, as a parent, don't "allow the label", you "accept the diagnosis" or else you get a "second opinion". Or you don't have your kid screened at all. Those are the options. Having your child diagnosed by a qualified professional and then ignoring/denying the diagnosis is not really good parenting, because a neurological condition isn't something a parent can make go away through willpower.

In your case, your grandpa suggested that you have your kid screened for autism. As a parent, your judgement was that there was nothing wrong and therefore no reason to have him screened. As he grew up fine and is not autistic, you saved yourself a potentially expensive series of wasted trips to the neurologist.

I'm not saying that erroneous diagnoses never happen... of course they do. Normally it's an issue of one disorder being mistaken for another, though, rather than a perfectly normal kid being diagnosed with a disorder. That happens too, but is rare. Autism is not a disorder that is treatable with pharmaceuticals, so the pervasive overdiagnosis that happens when there's a profit attached doesn't happen.

[Doktor Howl]

You keep saying "allow the label" like it's some sort of arbitrary sticky-tag some random entity wants to stick on kids. It's a neurological diagnosis. You, as a parent, don't "allow the label", you "accept the diagnosis" or else you get a "second opinion".

Good point.  In my case, however, it WAS a label, as The Terrible Old Man was not in fact a practicing neurologist.

But your other point is well taken.  The label would not have made a difference without a diagnosis.

[navkat]

As for the rates for girls....no-one knows, although it seems a well-established phenomenon.

One explanation I heard is that when it occurs in girls, the symptoms aren't as apparent as with boys. Also partly due to gender expectations, I think.

This. I didn't find out I might've been AS all along until my little brother (19 years younger than I) was was diagnosed looong after I became an adult. SOME of our traits are shared but mainly, I was (and still am) the weird girl in school. I have learned to play up my eccentricities in a way that's now more palettable than just being an obnoxious, clueless jackass. I am sometimes oblivious to how I'm being perceived by others and oblivious to others' feelings at times due to a lowered ability to read their feelings.

I have no head for math but I "see" words in my head. I can't express myself well verbally and constantly get myself in trouble when I misspeak or say things that don't match what I mean but I'm fairly well-written. Words, puns amuse me. Shapes of words. I've always wondered if this was close to the experience many with AS have with numbers and math.

[Placid Dingo]

One thing about 'labels' in general is they can help an individual understand themselves. Like your story with Epilepsy Nigel, it sounds to me (correct me if I'm wrong) that finding an explanation for the difficulties you were having was a releif, not a burdan.

One of the reasons I have a MBPTI fetish is because finding that I was listed as INTP and reading the description thereof helped some parts of who I am make more sense to me.

Generally I find it frustrating the resistance to labels on the grounds that 'they're labels'. I'm a man, I'm INT type, I'm a childhood cancer survivor, I'm a teacher; but as long as I and the people around me accept that I'm 'Dingo', and these labels imply parts of me but do not define me, that's OK.

[Rococo Modem Basilisk]

I highly doubt the tv/xbox angle, if only because autism manifests really early.  Speech delays are really common in ASD (I think they're actually required for a standard autism diagnosis?) - which means that autism has existed in a strong enough form to cause learning disability before babies normally start learning to speak.  It's really, really hard to play XBox with pre-speech motor skills.

I've heard jokes saying that the difference between a diagnosis of HFA and a diagnosis of Asperger's is that the person with HFA had a speech delay. But, I've also heard people say that the difference between a diagnosis of Asperger's and a diagnosis of PDD-NOS is whether or not the shrink considers 'autism' a stigmatic term.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

One thing about 'labels' in general is they can help an individual understand themselves. Like your story with Epilepsy Nigel, it sounds to me (correct me if I'm wrong) that finding an explanation for the difficulties you were having was a releif, not a burdan.

One of the reasons I have a MBPTI fetish is because finding that I was listed as INTP and reading the description thereof helped some parts of who I am make more sense to me.

Generally I find it frustrating the resistance to labels on the grounds that 'they're labels'. I'm a man, I'm INT type, I'm a childhood cancer survivor, I'm a teacher; but as long as I and the people around me accept that I'm 'Dingo', and these labels imply parts of me but do not define me, that's OK.

Yeah, I find that "label" is a tricky word. What is a label, other than a name for something? There are weird ways that people use these labels, too... look at people who make a single aspect of their reality into their whole identity. Two examples that come to mind are people who identify themselves by their chronic illness, and people who identify themselves by their sexuality. I might have epilepsy but it's not very defining of my personhood... it's not even in the top 100  things that would come to mind if I was asked to describe myself. Nor would ADHD or arrhythmia or sleeping with ladies or the scar on my left breast.

That said, there are sometimes valid reasons to avoid having a diagnosis in your medical records. For example, epilepsy is nowhere in my medical records, and the reason for this is that my doctor hesitates to officially record that diagnosis unless a patient needs medication, because people can lose their health and auto insurance. Because I have never had a grand mal seizure it seems like a pretty safe thing to omit from forms.

[Kai]

Ultimately, the problem with autistic spectrum disorders and many other, is that they simply describe the "symptoms". They don't actually diagnose the cause. And yet, these very shaky grounds are taken to write a manual which is treated in many circles as word of god.

So they're combining a whole bunch of different symptoms that were separate disorders under a single disorder. This re-categorization is about as physically relevant as changing Pluto to dwarf planet. It doesn't resolve the causes, it doesn't provide adequate treatment, it just switches the labels around. "OMG, we're going to combine PDD with AS, isn't that so much better? You get to be LABELED differently!"

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

Ultimately, the problem with autistic spectrum disorders and many other, is that they simply describe the "symptoms". They don't actually diagnose the cause. And yet, these very shaky grounds are taken to write a manual which is treated in many circles as word of god.

So they're combining a whole bunch of different symptoms that were separate disorders under a single disorder. This re-categorization is about as physically relevant as changing Pluto to dwarf planet. It doesn't resolve the causes, it doesn't provide adequate treatment, it just switches the labels around. "OMG, we're going to combine PDD with AS, isn't that so much better? You get to be LABELED differently!"

It's all part of the process of trying to understand it better. It's not arbitrary; it's a process, and hopefully every time they make these revisions they've gained a tiny bit more understanding about what it is they're trying to deal with.

[Mesozoic Mister Nigel]

This ties in quite closely with one of Roger's threads, the one about the lack advancement in psychology. Advances are being made, they're just moving very very slowly as the technology and theory to concretely understand brain processes develops. We are really only just now starting to have the technology to be able to look at the physical processes behind human behavior.