Well done, Britspags--No Michael Savage for YUO!

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Fuck the Law, anyone is pretty much free to say what they like anyway. You just need to be a bit careful about who you say it to. Having a Law that protects your right to stand on a busy street, shouting stupid
racist shit, or frothy Godgasmic threats of Hellfire on everyone, is crap anyway. If such people want to shout that stupid offensive hateful shit all day long, then I say go for it. But don't expect any help from the State when four big black lads, drag you off your soapbox, and kerbstomp you. If you take up your right to act like that in public, you are also accepting by default, what the consequences of behaving like this bring. If it gets you a kicking, then next time maybe you won't be so across the board. Because that's the thing. Your right to be as offensive as you like, comes hand in hand with everybody else's right to be as offended as they want. Hopefully, this should get people to take a little more responsibility
for their own actions, and their consequences.

Bump.

Okay.  But I get to decide what's offensive.

Of course you do. No one else has the right to tell you what you can be offended by.

(We're not communists)

Well, no, I mean I get to decide which speech voids your right to recourse to the law.

[Phox]

Fuck the Law, anyone is pretty much free to say what they like anyway. You just need to be a bit careful about who you say it to. Having a Law that protects your right to stand on a busy street, shouting stupid
racist shit, or frothy Godgasmic threats of Hellfire on everyone, is crap anyway. If such people want to shout that stupid offensive hateful shit all day long, then I say go for it. But don't expect any help from the State when four big black lads, drag you off your soapbox, and kerbstomp you. If you take up your right to act like that in public, you are also accepting by default, what the consequences of behaving like this bring. If it gets you a kicking, then next time maybe you won't be so across the board. Because that's the thing. Your right to be as offensive as you like, comes hand in hand with everybody else's right to be as offended as they want. Hopefully, this should get people to take a little more responsibility
for their own actions, and their consequences.

Bump.

Okay.  But I get to decide what's offensive.

Of course you do. No one else has the right to tell you what you can be offended by.

(We're not communists)

Well, no, I mean I get to decide which speech voids your right to recourse to the law.

May I suggest using everything I've ever said ever as a starting point? If I said it, it was guaranteed to offend at least one group of sentient beings.

[BadBeast]

Fuck the Law, anyone is pretty much free to say what they like anyway. You just need to be a bit careful about who you say it to. Having a Law that protects your right to stand on a busy street, shouting stupid
racist shit, or frothy Godgasmic threats of Hellfire on everyone, is crap anyway. If such people want to shout that stupid offensive hateful shit all day long, then I say go for it. But don't expect any help from the State when four big black lads, drag you off your soapbox, and kerbstomp you. If you take up your right to act like that in public, you are also accepting by default, what the consequences of behaving like this bring. If it gets you a kicking, then next time maybe you won't be so across the board. Because that's the thing. Your right to be as offensive as you like, comes hand in hand with everybody else's right to be as offended as they want. Hopefully, this should get people to take a little more responsibility
for their own actions, and their consequences.

Bump.

Okay.  But I get to decide what's offensive.

Of course you do. No one else has the right to tell you what you can be offended by.

(We're not communists)

Well, no, I mean I get to decide which speech voids your right to recourse to the law.

I'm proposing having no Legal interference whatsoever in what people say.

[BadBeast]

When did a law ever stop you from saying what you wanted anyway. You'd say it where no-one but the person you were talking to would hear it, but that's not such a bad thing. Then if that person was offended, by what you said, should they have the recourse to call the Police and say "Roger just said ***** to me! Come and arrest him!"?

[BadBeast]

If you answer "no,of course he shouldn't" then by default, there must be a Legal right for you to sit there and offend the very bones of his soul, and there must be legally nothing he is able to do about it. Which means you can call the Police, and say "***** is trying to stop me verbally offending him", can you come and enforce my right to offend this precious little flower" And they will have to come and uphold your right to be offensive to him. Stand over you if need be. Which is equally ridiculous.

Nobody has the right to live every day with the legal knowledge that nobody is allowed to offend them. Under penalty of Law.
But nobody should be empowered by the Law, to walk around being offensive to whosover they choose, in a way that they wouldn't dare, if there weren't armed Police there to uphold his  offensiveness. So if the Law were totally to duck out on this one, then people would either have to moderate their stupid mouths, to take other peoples sensitivities into account, or be prepared to defend their speech themselves. If you go into East LA, and start ranting about how niggers should all be rounded up, and put into work camps, then you had better be made of fucking metal. Or kill you. So you wouldn't ever do that, even if it was what you believed. You might say it to your mate, under your breath. Which (depending on who your mate is) is probably not going toget you killed. 

[Prince Glittersnatch III]

If you answer "no,of course he shouldn't" then by default, there must be a Legal right for you to sit there and offend the very bones of his soul, and there must be legally nothing he is able to do about it. Which means you can call the Police, and say "***** is trying to stop me verbally offending him", can you come and enforce my right to offend this precious little flower" And they will have to come and uphold your right to be offensive to him. Stand over you if need be. Which is equally ridiculous.

Nobody has the right to live every day with the legal knowledge that nobody is allowed to offend them. Under penalty of Law.
But nobody should be empowered by the Law, to walk around being offensive to whosover they choose, in a way that they wouldn't dare, if there weren't armed Police there to uphold his  offensiveness. So if the Law were totally to duck out on this one, then people would either have to moderate their stupid mouths, to take other peoples sensitivities into account, or be prepared to defend their speech themselves. If you go into East LA, and start ranting about how niggers should all be rounded up, and put into work camps, then you had better be made of fucking metal. Or kill you. So you wouldn't ever do that, even if it was what you believed. You might say it to your mate, under your breath. Which (depending on who your mate is) is probably not going toget you killed. 

I dont get the point youre trying to make.

People should act as if they didnt have police to protect them?
No offense but if absolutely no one was around to enforce the whole "dont fucking murder each other" rule people wouldnt be worrying about "upholding their offensiveness" theyd be more worried about upholding their fucking property. You would have to "uphold" your speech as well against the very people you are talking about. I have no doubts in my mind that Rush Limbaugh would be the first to organize lynching parties if the kind of anarchy you described breaks out.

Also, if I think that the guy Im talking to has a loaded .44 and absolutely no reserves about killing those who "offend" him Im not going to even go so far as disagreeing with him about ANYTHING.

The kind of free speech you are describing is basically:

"Dont say ANYTHING controversial. Dont say anything that goes against the majority opinion. If you absolutely HAVE to express an opinion on something do it behind closed doors where no one can see."

Which kind of misses the point of free speech.

[BadBeast]

All I'm saying is that we got on more or less intact without Police forces up until about 150 years ago. I think people are tricked into thinking we have to keep upgrading their remit every time someone attempts to do anything to anyone that doesn't involve them overlooking every fucking move, in case anyone gets hurt, or offended, or yes, even killed. How did people resolve stuff they disagreed over, for the 30,000 years we were surviving without Police Forces? What happened? Oh,that's right, people were a little more guarded with the insults,and the hate stuff, because they knew if they overstepped the bounds of acceptable, then they were going to have to deal with the consequences, when the offended party called them on it. Either apologise,or tell them to fuck off. It was their call. There were no Nanny Police around to uphold one, or the other's point. They had to THINK FOR THEMSELVES. They had to be more aware of other peoples views. A bit more careful before they started yelling EAT A DICK, and calling each other Motherfuckers. That kind of thing.

[Prince Glittersnatch III]

All I'm saying is that we got on more or less intact without Police forces up until about 150 years ago. I think people are tricked into thinking we have to keep upgrading their remit every time someone attempts to do anything to anyone that doesn't involve them overlooking every fucking move, in case anyone gets hurt, or offended, or yes, even killed. How did people resolve stuff they disagreed over, for the 30,000 years we were surviving without Police Forces? What happened? Oh,that's right, people were a little more guarded with the insults,and the hate stuff, because they knew if they overstepped the bounds of acceptable, then they were going to have to deal with the consequences, when the offended party called them on it. Either apologise,or tell them to fuck off. It was their call. There were no Nanny Police around to uphold one, or the other's point. They had to THINK FOR THEMSELVES. They had to be more aware of other peoples views. A bit more careful before they started yelling EAT A DICK, and calling each other Motherfuckers. That kind of thing.

They also lynched a lot more niggers 150 years ago. People would have spoken up about it, but they didnt want to "overstep the bounds of the acceptable".

And fostering a culture where only those opinions deemed acceptable by the majority is hardly a way to encourage people to THINK FOR THEMSELVES.

[BadBeast]

I bet there are more black men put on Death row now, per year, than were lynched 150 years ago. And that was a particularly American thing, that didn't happen all over. Murder rates were not significantly higher back then. There was probably less crime too. And more interpersonal communication between ordinary individuals, when it came to sorting out disputes. And this illusion that the Law is protecting us from the bad guys, it's ridiculous. We are far more vulnerable to exploitation on a scale unthinkable in our Grandfather'sor Great Grandfather's day.

Look what's happened in the last 5 years. Where  did all the money go? Why are we all at War? Who has to pay all that money back? Every financial transaction we make, is getting a cut taken from it, and all the pension schemes gone up in "Hedge Funds", and Market Crashes, All the Legislation we have in place today, and we still get fleeced every step of the way. You say slavery has been abolished? Have a look at your Prison system then! Tell me that this is what you do with your Criminals? The Criminals are all in the Governments now! We lost, and we lost big time by giving the administration and power to these fucking Pirates, bit by bit, over the years. They are the ones we are at risk from. They are the ones who extort us until we are forced to work for fuck all, until we are 65 or 70, then we get to retire on a tiny percentage of what we actually put by for old age,because they have stolen it all, and fucked us over with their "Legislation". In 1914, Europe lost a whole Generation of it's menfolk. So Laws and measures were taken to see that it could never happen again. 20 Years later, what happens? we're at it again. We didn't start those Wars. They did. consolidating their power structure every step of the way, so that in the post war years, no-one would be able to challenge their hold on everything.

And you're worried about your right to "free speech"?  Where did free speech get you when the sub-prime lending scam was being carried out right under your noses? Where was free speech when Bush decided to go to War with Iraq? Did anyone listen to you? To what you had to say? Did they fuck! You can have as much free speech as you like, they are never going to listen to you. They will just keep everyone squabbling over who called who a nigger, and who say the wrong prayers, who sing the wrong songs, and while you are fighting to keep  your home, or your job, they are filling their pockets with all the money they've stolen. And not only are they thieving bastards, they are making you and me pay back the money they stole from us, to the people who fucking stole it from us!

" Fostering a culture where only those opinions deem acceptable by the majority is hardly a way to encourage people to THINK FOR THEMSELVES"  ???????
WAKEY WAKEY!!!. What do you think a Western Democracy is then? Especially a Two Party one, that is so easy to manipulate, and
Keep the population diametrically opposed. Democrats think Republicans are the enemy? Republicans think Democrats are. How long has this been going on for then?  Hmmm, . . ? And you still haven't worked it out. You are the grist in the mill. The meat in the mincer. And you still vehemently defend the System that has you bent over a barrell, assprone, while it's balls are slapping against your arsecheeks. Your eyes fixed on a 48 inch plasma screen, while you play WoW on your PS3.

You know I don't mean you personally don't you? And I mean me too when I point out how cold that barrell of Oil is. And our political system isn't much better than yours. Worse in some ways. But that is just the icing on the Cake. we are fucked Royally, as long as we let them keep their grip on our throats. So what are we going to do about? Fuck all. Nothing. Show up at the next Election, vote for the new great white hope, (Dosesn't matter who) SO LONG AS  THE ILLUSION OFCONTROL UNDER THEIR LAWS IS MAINTAINED, THEN THEY CAN CARRY ON AS THEY WERE BEFORE. We deserve them. We allow them to do it to us. We are even thanking them. They break our legs, and we say thank you when they offer us crutches!           **Spits** .   

[Prince Glittersnatch III]

Are we even arguing about the same thing at this point?

[BadBeast]

Are we even arguing about the same thing at this point?

Probably not, I got sidetracked by my Hi performance brayne into ranting, without the "A" word. Wasn't even arguing really. Or was I ? 

Ah, I see your tactics now, confused would I?