REEFER MADNESS!!!!!!

[AFK]

Gov decides not to have scientific advice on drugs any more
British government abandons policy of actually asking real scientists for scientific advice because it turns out that real scientists won't just rubber stamp whatever ridiculousness the politicians come up with
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/12/06/science_advice/

The coalition government is ditching the requirement to seek scientific advice before setting drugs policy.

As part of the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971 government must take, or at least listen to, advice from the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs. That committee needed to have at least six scientists on it.

But police reform legislation introduced last week will remove the requirement to listen to annoying scientists before setting policy.

Just want to point out this wouldn't fly in the U.S. in the current funding climate.  You can't get funding these days if your work is not evidence-based. 

[AFK]

I'm a little surprised this hasn't shown up in this thread yet:

http://www.jointogether.org/news/headlines/inthenews/2010/dea-bans-synthetic-marijuana.html

The U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) has enacted an emergency ban on five synthetic marijuana chemicals, The New York Times reported Nov. 24.

During the temporary ban, the DEA said they will research if the products should remain illegal, controlled substances permanently.

"Synthetic marijuana" -- which had been sold legally as incense under brand names such as "K2" and "Spice" -- is an herb-and-chemical compound that, when smoked, simulates the effects of the tetrahydrocannabinol, or THC, in marijuana.

"Makers of these harmful products mislead their customers into thinking that 'fake pot' is a harmless alternative to illegal drugs, but that is not the case," said Michele M. Leonhart, the acting administrator of the DEA. "Today's action will call further attention to the risks of ingesting unknown compounds and will hopefully take away any incentive to try these products."

The DEA said they designated the chemicals as Schedule I substances in response to a rise in reports from hospitals, poison-control centers, and law enforcement agencies since 2009.

At least fifteen states, several localities, and parts of Europe, previously had banned or restricted the products.

The one-year ban (with a possible six-month extension) will go into effect in about 30 days.

[Cain]

Gov decides not to have scientific advice on drugs any more
British government abandons policy of actually asking real scientists for scientific advice because it turns out that real scientists won't just rubber stamp whatever ridiculousness the politicians come up with
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/12/06/science_advice/

The coalition government is ditching the requirement to seek scientific advice before setting drugs policy.

As part of the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971 government must take, or at least listen to, advice from the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs. That committee needed to have at least six scientists on it.

But police reform legislation introduced last week will remove the requirement to listen to annoying scientists before setting policy.

Just want to point out this wouldn't fly in the U.S. in the current funding climate.  You can't get funding these days if your work is not evidence-based. 

That would be sensible.

The government is also demanding addicts go cold turkey, rather than wean themselves off drugs via lower usage.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

I'm a little surprised this hasn't shown up in this thread yet:

http://www.jointogether.org/news/headlines/inthenews/2010/dea-bans-synthetic-marijuana.html

The U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) has enacted an emergency ban on five synthetic marijuana chemicals, The New York Times reported Nov. 24.

During the temporary ban, the DEA said they will research if the products should remain illegal, controlled substances permanently.

"Synthetic marijuana" -- which had been sold legally as incense under brand names such as "K2" and "Spice" -- is an herb-and-chemical compound that, when smoked, simulates the effects of the tetrahydrocannabinol, or THC, in marijuana.

"Makers of these harmful products mislead their customers into thinking that 'fake pot' is a harmless alternative to illegal drugs, but that is not the case," said Michele M. Leonhart, the acting administrator of the DEA. "Today's action will call further attention to the risks of ingesting unknown compounds and will hopefully take away any incentive to try these products."

The DEA said they designated the chemicals as Schedule I substances in response to a rise in reports from hospitals, poison-control centers, and law enforcement agencies since 2009.

At least fifteen states, several localities, and parts of Europe, previously had banned or restricted the products.

The one-year ban (with a possible six-month extension) will go into effect in about 30 days.

So the synthetic stuff is putting people in hospitals and poison control centers... while the actual stuff doesn't.

Now that's some irony.

[Telarus]

The very existence of K2 comes from the dogmatic idealization of Prohibition (much like the majority share of the black market violence). I'm all for banning K2, but not for it's THC content (for the harm that has been evidentarily demonstrated).

[Cramulus]

does anybody have links to data about the hospitals and poison control centers?

[AFK]

I don't have data, just anecdotal stuff from my friend and colleague who works at the New England Poison Center.  They have been getting a lot of calls regarding the K2 and Spice, mostly from parents I think. 

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

I think I read that at high doses it may cause seizures in some people... also that at very high doses it may be possible to overdose, since the synthetic stuff apparently connects to the receptors in the brain better than actual THC.

However, I haven't found anything that directly ties Spice to death or serious problems, there were a couple deaths in Indiana one of which was a person that had recently smoked Spice. There were also some people that showed up at hospital with "Cannabis Intoxication" symptoms but didn't test positive for it (since they were using the synthetic).

Most of the warnings I've seen in my short Internet search had more to do with it being an untested chemical compound with unknown effects, rather than any list of known/defined effects.

I haven't tried it and I generally shy away from any drug they're selling at the local 7/11.

[Cramulus]

(edit for fixing stupid hotlink prevention stupidness stupidheads i hate those kind of people)

[Telarus]

http://www.tokeofthetown.com/2010/12/jury_pool_in_marijuana_case_stages_mutiny_wont_con.php

Montana jury pool 'stages a mutiny' at the attempt to prosecute this guy for 1/16 of an ounce, jury can't get seated for this charge. Judge, defense  and prosecutor work out a deal where he pleads 'no guilt', but still gets sentenced (20 years !! 19 of them suspended, the remaining 1 year to be served along side his prior conviction of Theft).

This case's jury was not allowed to be seated until the judge and prosecutor had weeded out (lol) everyone there who knew about 'jury nullification' (see the comment about dismissing potential jurors who had 'philosophical objections').

Also, it's buried in at the end, but the Judge comments on the age range of the objectors, and that the most vocal was a 60yr old woman, and wisely points out that even if he got a jury of 12 people who bought hard line drug prohibition, would that be a neutral group of the accused 'peers'? Or would it just be a minority of the population biased in the 'pro- prohibition' direction.

[Telarus]

http://www.boingboing.net/2011/01/10/restricting-sale-of.html

Restricting sale of cold medicine creates lucrative black market
Mark Frauenfelder at 10:13 PM Monday, Jan 10, 2011

The tracking system laws that make it inconvenient to buy cold medicine have not slowed down the meth trade one bit. In fact, they've created a new "sub-criminal culture," says an agent with the DEA.

The practice has not only failed to curb the meth trade, which is growing again after a brief decline. It also created a vast and highly lucrative market for profiteers to buy over-the-counter pills and sell them to meth producers at a huge markup.

...

Since tracking laws were enacted beginning in 2006, the number of meth busts nationwide has started climbing again. Some experts say the black market for cold pills contributed to that spike. Other factors are at play, too, such as meth trafficking by Mexican cartels and new methods for making small amounts of meth.

Radley Balko of Reason says: "Meth use was also up 34 percent in 2009. So the new laws are inconveniencing law-abiding people who want to treat cold and allergy symptoms, have had either zero or a positive effect on meth use, have lured new people into the meth trade, and have created a bigger market for smuggling meth and meth ingredients into the country from Mexico."

This is a big win for law enforcement and the prison industry. Look for even more restrictive cold medicine laws in the future.

http://www.theagitator.com/2011/01/10/shockingly-anti-meth-laws-have-had-unintended-consequences/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+radleybalko+%28The+Agitator%29&utm_content=Google+Reader

[Telarus]

Tracked down the original article.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_drug_war_tracking_meth

[AFK]

http://www.boingboing.net/2011/01/10/restricting-sale-of.html

Restricting sale of cold medicine creates lucrative black market
Mark Frauenfelder at 10:13 PM Monday, Jan 10, 2011

The tracking system laws that make it inconvenient to buy cold medicine have not slowed down the meth trade one bit. In fact, they've created a new "sub-criminal culture," says an agent with the DEA.

The practice has not only failed to curb the meth trade, which is growing again after a brief decline. It also created a vast and highly lucrative market for profiteers to buy over-the-counter pills and sell them to meth producers at a huge markup.

...

Since tracking laws were enacted beginning in 2006, the number of meth busts nationwide has started climbing again. Some experts say the black market for cold pills contributed to that spike. Other factors are at play, too, such as meth trafficking by Mexican cartels and new methods for making small amounts of meth.

Radley Balko of Reason says: "Meth use was also up 34 percent in 2009. So the new laws are inconveniencing law-abiding people who want to treat cold and allergy symptoms, have had either zero or a positive effect on meth use, have lured new people into the meth trade, and have created a bigger market for smuggling meth and meth ingredients into the country from Mexico."

This is a big win for law enforcement and the prison industry. Look for even more restrictive cold medicine laws in the future.

http://www.theagitator.com/2011/01/10/shockingly-anti-meth-laws-have-had-unintended-consequences/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+radleybalko+%28The+Agitator%29&utm_content=Google+Reader

Just want to point out that the article was reasonable and balanced until the bolded sentence, which, is 100% horseshit.  The reasons to put cold medicines behind the counter were many but I can tell you that one of them was NOT to pad the bank accounts of wardens and police chiefs.  It was partly in response to kids and others getting recipes to make meth off the internet, getting the stuff at the pharmacy, and making small batches of meth for personal use/experimentation at home.  As with any policy, there is never 100% guarantee it will have the impact you hope for.  So obviously, those who make the policies need to take this data and information into account and adjust. 

But it really is disgusting to me, as someone who works shoulder to shoulder with people in law enforcement, to take this and turn it on law enforcement officials and blame them. 

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

http://www.boingboing.net/2011/01/10/restricting-sale-of.html

Restricting sale of cold medicine creates lucrative black market
Mark Frauenfelder at 10:13 PM Monday, Jan 10, 2011

The tracking system laws that make it inconvenient to buy cold medicine have not slowed down the meth trade one bit. In fact, they've created a new "sub-criminal culture," says an agent with the DEA.

The practice has not only failed to curb the meth trade, which is growing again after a brief decline. It also created a vast and highly lucrative market for profiteers to buy over-the-counter pills and sell them to meth producers at a huge markup.

...

Since tracking laws were enacted beginning in 2006, the number of meth busts nationwide has started climbing again. Some experts say the black market for cold pills contributed to that spike. Other factors are at play, too, such as meth trafficking by Mexican cartels and new methods for making small amounts of meth.

Radley Balko of Reason says: "Meth use was also up 34 percent in 2009. So the new laws are inconveniencing law-abiding people who want to treat cold and allergy symptoms, have had either zero or a positive effect on meth use, have lured new people into the meth trade, and have created a bigger market for smuggling meth and meth ingredients into the country from Mexico."

This is a big win for law enforcement and the prison industry. Look for even more restrictive cold medicine laws in the future.

http://www.theagitator.com/2011/01/10/shockingly-anti-meth-laws-have-had-unintended-consequences/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+radleybalko+%28The+Agitator%29&utm_content=Google+Reader

Just want to point out that the article was reasonable and balanced until the bolded sentence, which, is 100% horseshit.  The reasons to put cold medicines behind the counter were many but I can tell you that one of them was NOT to pad the bank accounts of wardens and police chiefs.  It was partly in response to kids and others getting recipes to make meth off the internet, getting the stuff at the pharmacy, and making small batches of meth for personal use/experimentation at home.  As with any policy, there is never 100% guarantee it will have the impact you hope for.  So obviously, those who make the policies need to take this data and information into account and adjust. 

But it really is disgusting to me, as someone who works shoulder to shoulder with people in law enforcement, to take this and turn it on law enforcement officials and blame them. 

I think that was Telarus' comment... I didn't see it in the linked blog. The linked blog ended with:

But perhaps we should go easy on the politicians who passed these laws. I mean, it's not like anyone could possibly have predicted any of this.

with a link to Reason Magazine:

http://reason.com/search?cx=000107342346889757597%3Ascm_knrboh8&cof=FORID%3A11&ie=UTF-8&q=meth+cold+medicine&sa=Search#1224

[The Good Reverend Roger]

All I know is that they arrested a man here for buying an extra package of sudafed to take to camp with him.  The extra pack put them over the limit.  Despite common sense, the man was arrested and arraigned.