Excuse me while I vomit.- Trigger Warning for Rape and Rape Culture.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

and passed out drunk is DO NEVAR!

Again, arrangements made in advance.  We have both agreed that incoherency is not an obstacle, as we're both just fine with being on the receiving end of that sort of thing.  Although I do have to say that it's a one-way street, because I personally couldn't get excited if she was to be actually unconscious (she doesn't ever drink that much, so it's moot anyway).   She, on the other hand, is immoral as hell, and fails to respect my Holy™ personage under any circumstances.

But in any other situation, you are 169% correct.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

"silence is consent" :/

In our house, a pulse is consent, apparently.   

But again, we are both very comfortable with each other, and we know our limitations.  In any other situation, consent is never a default, so silence is NOT consent. 

And, as Pixie says, "GEROFF" nullifies all pre-existing arrangements.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Are you suggesting we E-Prime statements about rape?







Although, that would certainly be effective.

How about:

"Rape is the act of having sex with someone without their prior consent or ability to give consent."

That's overly simplistic. A lot of men out there who are going too far are unclear on the very concept of consent.

Absolutely correct.  I was speaking to what I perceive as a general understanding in THIS crowd.

Consent:  An active acceptance of the proposed activities.  Yes = consent, no = not consent, no answer = no = not consent.

The whole thing boils down to your attitude toward other people.  If this sort of shit has to be explained, then the person you are explaining to cannot follow you on a moral level.  They may act appropriately to avoid legal trouble, etc (which is usually enough), but they still won't respect the other person as a person.

And that's the heart of the matter.  People who "weasel" the rules - or fail to follow them at all - do so because they do not place any value on the other person as a human being.

I am unsure if any level of explanation (not involving a halligan tool) would make them understand.

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Or the idea of ' she isn't saying no so thats yes'. Which obviously is not right.

That's a direct offshoot of the "no means no" campaign, which essentially placed responsibility for rape on the woman.

The whole "but did you say no?" defense.

"No means no" was a good start...In the 1980s.  The situation hasn't gotten worse to require a more clear understanding, it's just that the information being imparted was inadequate in the first place.

[Pope Pixie Pickle]

Sometimes PeeDee restores my faith in humanity by a couple percent. This thread is one of those times.

And then I see how much we fight with each other, and I'm confused again.

[LMNO]

Considering we have to voluntarily log in to PD, I always assume that means we consent to fight with each other.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Sometimes PeeDee restores my faith in humanity by a couple percent. This thread is one of those times.

And then I see how much we fight with each other, and I'm confused again.

Thinking monkeys, while rare, are still monkeys

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Sometimes PeeDee restores my faith in humanity by a couple percent. This thread is one of those times.

And then I see how much we fight with each other, and I'm confused again.

I'm not confused at all.  PD is full of smart people, and we preach individuality.  That is not a recipe for consensus on too many topics.

I'm glad we seem to have a consensus on this particular subject.  The quibbling here is mostly over details, not over the general message.

The one thing PD IS a good recipe for is feminism the way I understand it¹:  All humans have all the same rights and responsibilities, regardless of gender, orientation, race, or anything else.




¹ You may notice that there is a type of person who cannot accept this idea, and refers to feminism as an alleged list of "special rights" for women, etc.  These people are morons, and can usually be found explaining why Jesus owns your ovaries.

[Bebek Sincap Ratatosk]

Sometimes PeeDee restores my faith in humanity by a couple percent. This thread is one of those times.

And then I see how much we fight with each other, and I'm confused again.

I'm not confused at all.  PD is full of smart people, and we preach individuality.  That is not a recipe for consensus on too many topics.

I'm glad we seem to have a consensus on this particular subject.  The quibbling here is mostly over details, not over the general message.

The one thing PD IS a good recipe for is feminism the way I understand it¹:  All humans have all the same rights and responsibilities, regardless of gender, orientation, race, or anything else.




¹ You may notice that there is a type of person who cannot accept this idea, and refers to feminism as an alleged list of "special rights" for women, etc.  These people are morons, and can usually be found explaining why Jesus owns your ovaries.

Agreed. Equal is Equal and should be Equal for everyone. Anything else is bullshit.

[Anna Mae Bollocks]

Are you suggesting we E-Prime statements about rape?







Although, that would certainly be effective.

How about:

"Rape is the act of having sex with someone without their prior consent or ability to give consent."

That's overly simplistic. A lot of men out there who are going too far are unclear on the very concept of consent.

Absolutely correct.  I was speaking to what I perceive as a general understanding in THIS crowd.

Consent:  An active acceptance of the proposed activities.  Yes = consent, no = not consent, no answer = no = not consent.

The whole thing boils down to your attitude toward other people. If this sort of shit has to be explained, then the person you are explaining to cannot follow you on a moral level.  They may act appropriately to avoid legal trouble, etc (which is usually enough), but they still won't respect the other person as a person.

And that's the heart of the matter.  People who "weasel" the rules - or fail to follow them at all - do so because they do not place any value on the other person as a human being.

I am unsure if any level of explanation (not involving a halligan tool) would make them understand.

Yep.

Or the idea of ' she isn't saying no so thats yes'. Which obviously is not right.

That and the fact that there are people out there who misread everything as "SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME", to wit:

"She dropped something and bent over to pick it up. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"She smiled. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"Her nipples are hard. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME." (Never mind that the ambient temperature is about 40F.)

etc.

[Pope Pixie Pickle]

Considering we have to voluntarily log in to PD, I always assume that means we consent to fight with each other.

This is a cogent and very valid point.

[Pope Pixie Pickle]

Or the idea of ' she isn't saying no so thats yes'. Which obviously is not right.

That and the fact that there are people out there who misread everything as "SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME", to wit:

"She dropped something and bent over to pick it up. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"She smiled. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"Her nipples are hard. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME." (Never mind that the ambient temperature is about 40F.)

etc.

aaand that's the short hand version of the women as public property and objectification aspect of rape culture, right there. 

[The Good Reverend Roger]

Or the idea of ' she isn't saying no so thats yes'. Which obviously is not right.

That and the fact that there are people out there who misread everything as "SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME", to wit:

"She dropped something and bent over to pick it up. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"She smiled. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"Her nipples are hard. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME." (Never mind that the ambient temperature is about 40F.)

etc.

aaand that's the short hand version of the women as public property and objectification aspect of rape culture, right there.

Also, one fuck of a case of confirmation bias.

[LMNO]

That and the fact that there are people out there who misread everything as "SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME", to wit:

"She dropped something and bent over to pick it up. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"She smiled. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"Her nipples are hard. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME." (Never mind that the ambient temperature is about 40F.)

etc.

This in itself isn't so bad, provided the person in questions asks first.

She dropped something and bent over to pick it up. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME.
"Hey, do you want to fuck me?"

She smiled. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME.
"Hey, do you want to fuck me?"

Her nipples are hard. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME. (Never mind that the ambient temperature is about 40F.)
"Hey, do you want to go somewhere warmer, and fuck me?"

[The Good Reverend Roger]

That and the fact that there are people out there who misread everything as "SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME", to wit:

"She dropped something and bent over to pick it up. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"She smiled. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME."

"Her nipples are hard. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME." (Never mind that the ambient temperature is about 40F.)

etc.

This in itself isn't so bad, provided the person in questions asks first.

She dropped something and bent over to pick it up. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME.
"Hey, do you want to fuck me?"

She smiled. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME.
"Hey, do you want to fuck me?"

Her nipples are hard. SHE WANTS TO FUCK ME. (Never mind that the ambient temperature is about 40F.)
"Hey, do you want to go somewhere warmer, and fuck me?"

at the last one.